Changes in the SFQC

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Leatherneck
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Changes in the SFQC

Post by Leatherneck »

There are big changes in the near future for the SFQC. Those coming in the following months can expect a different experience from that current students are having. The cover article in this month's Special Warfare magazine highlighted the changes that going to be phased in over the next 18-24 months.

Here are some highlights from the article:


Directly from one of the visuals in the article:
Blueprint for Change
1. Create a Student Reception Center (all personnel services)
DLAB, Security Clearance, SF Group assignment, MOS and foreign language assingment will all be made at the start of the SFQC.

2. SFAS - develop the "whole man" concept. Identify characteristics of the SF Warrior (Reduce or eliminate training during this phase).

3. Phase II - Small Unit Tactics (SUT); integrate SERE; PGD/HD*; Language Block I; incorporate Common Leader Training (CLT).

4. Phase III - MOS Training; integrate Instructor Trainer Course; add SF Common Tasks; digitized POI; Language block II; DLPT

5. Phase IV - Language Block III "The Blitz"; DLPT; maintain warrior edge, range firing, etc.

6. Phase V - UW Culmination excersise "Robin Sage" - the final exam; regional orientation and language segments; intelligence operations

7. Phase VI - Regimental first formation and graduation

*Peacetime Governmental Dentention/Hostage Detention (PGD/HD)
The article covers a few other areas that comprise the backbone of the transformation:

1. The new, modular approach - basically, the course will be broken into more, smaller modules of shorter duration than the current, linear phase system. Instead of recycling an entire phase, if the student is only having trouble with one segment of the training they could just recycle that segment. It will also permit the interspersal of langauge blocks within the course. Phase II, for instance, has been a 35 day attempt at "mini-Ranger School" up to this point. After the transformation, it will be broken into 5 seperate modules, including SERE. A new module will start every 2 weeks.

2. Emphasis on Language - this is already happening. In my class (I'm in language school currently) they have already raised the standard for passing from 0+,0+,0+ to 1,1,1. They are going to sprinkle the language training throughout the course, and integrate the foreign language into the UW Culex.

3. In addition to the familiar Pineland scenario, the SFQC will starting sending soldiers to Ft. Erwin for the UW Culex. The idea is also to begin integrating the specific langauge and culture of the group to which the soldiers are assigned into the Culex.

When I got to the course last Nov, we all stood in formation according to our SF MOS. The newest groups arriving are being put into ODAs that will go through the whole course together (18D excepted, as I understand it). Things are changing around here fast. If you're coming to the Q-course in the near future, you can consider most off-the-bookshelf descriptions of the course to be outdated.
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Smiddy
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Post by Smiddy »

4-6 months of language, then Sage? We'll see how this works out...

It sounds like one of those things that brief well. I don't know whose filling the heads of USJFKSWC with this language importance.

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Post by 18Z5V »

That's a pretty ambitious plan. What is SWC going to do? Mass produce SERE and PGHD classes and expand RTL?
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Post by Guest »

18C4V wrote:That's a pretty ambitious plan. What is SWC going to do? Mass produce SERE and PGHD classes and expand RTL?
Expand the RTL?? :twisted:

That's one way to weed people out! I volunteer to be a guest interrogator! :twisted:

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Post by Vee »

You need to volunteer an account and an introduction, high speed :evil:
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Post by Smiddy »

:oops: :oops:

Uh...that was me!

Clicked on the link from the email announcment... must not have logged on.

knockin' em out Vee; must be smarter than the equipment I work with.
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Post by Leatherneck »

18C4V wrote:That's a pretty ambitious plan. What is SWC going to do? Mass produce SERE and PGHD classes and expand RTL?
I don't know, but for better or worse these changes are already beginning. It's gone from planning to implementation. The first modular Phase II is in the field as we speak.
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Post by RRDTm3 »

Anonymous wrote:
18C4V wrote:That's a pretty ambitious plan. What is SWC going to do? Mass produce SERE and PGHD classes and expand RTL?
Expand the RTL?? :twisted:

That's one way to weed people out! I volunteer to be a guest interrogator! :twisted:

I would make an excellent "GUEST SLAPPER" myself! :roll:
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Post by Bandito »

Boots, Boots, Boots.....Criminal #16 reporting sir!

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Post by Psywar1-0 »

Im all for the better language requirements.

Im a grad of the PRARNG Intensive Spanish Course and the DLI Brasilian Portugese course, and was able to remember enough French from HS and College to get a 1/1 on that DLPT. I was not impressed with the language skills of the folks that SWC sent to me in the late 90s.

Ive worked with a couple ODA's in the last 6 months that were about half and half FOG's and SF Babies. The Babies needed help ordering food, in an easy language like Spanish. I shudder to think about the skills that folks are leaving the school house with for MSA or Urdu.

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Post by Smiddy »

Psywar1-0 wrote:Im all for the better language requirements.

Im a grad of the PRARNG Intensive Spanish Course and the DLI Brasilian Portugese course, and was able to remember enough French from HS and College to get a 1/1 on that DLPT. I was not impressed with the language skills of the folks that SWC sent to me in the late 90s.

Ive worked with a couple ODA's in the last 6 months that were about half and half FOG's and SF Babies. The Babies needed help ordering food, in an easy language like Spanish. I shudder to think about the skills that folks are leaving the school house with for MSA or Urdu.
The SOLT language course is not comprehensive. Language as it stands in SF operations is for rapport building. Emphasis is placed on warfighting skills above language.

Your a team sergeant. Pick between an 18C who has a 3+3+ in arabic and knows fuckall about charges, breaching, or basic carpentry; and an 18C with a 0+0+ that has mastered field expedient and improvised explosives and can build your ops room.
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Post by Psywar1-0 »

Smiddy wrote: The SOLT language course is not comprehensive. Language as it stands in SF operations is for rapport building. Emphasis is placed on warfighting skills above language.

Your a team sergeant. Pick between an 18C who has a 3+3+ in arabic and knows fuckall about charges, breaching, or basic carpentry; and an 18C with a 0+0+ that has mastered field expedient and improvised explosives and can build your ops room.
All depends on the mission. For a DA mission Id pick the guy who was good with the Boom Boom clay. If its a FID mission teaching basic tng to a bunch of Haji's, Id want the guy who knows the difference between "keep you finger off the trigger while IMTing" and "Thanks, but Butt Sex between joes is not acceptable in my Army"

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Post by Kilted Heathen »

Psywar1-0 wrote:
Smiddy wrote: The SOLT language course is not comprehensive. Language as it stands in SF operations is for rapport building. Emphasis is placed on warfighting skills above language.

Your a team sergeant. Pick between an 18C who has a 3+3+ in arabic and knows fuckall about charges, breaching, or basic carpentry; and an 18C with a 0+0+ that has mastered field expedient and improvised explosives and can build your ops room.
All depends on the mission. For a DA mission Id pick the guy who was good with the Boom Boom clay. If its a FID mission teaching basic tng to a bunch of Haji's, Id want the guy who knows the difference between "keep you finger off the trigger while IMTing" and "Thanks, but Butt Sex between joes is not acceptable in my Army"
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Post by Leatherneck »

Smiddy wrote:Your a team sergeant. Pick between an 18C who has a 3+3+ in arabic and knows fuckall about charges, breaching, or basic carpentry; and an 18C with a 0+0+ that has mastered field expedient and improvised explosives and can build your ops room.
I hear you, but the two are not mutually exclusive. There is no reason, if you choose to apply yourself, you cannot learn a lot in language school even with the SOLT program. It's not like you have to choose between going to langauge school and going to the 18C course. You ARE going to be going to both. So why not try to be a good 18C in your MOS, and bring a reasonable level of langauge ability to your team? I don't see a contradiction.

There are guys in my class who are blowing off language school on the idea (maybe true, I wouldn't know) that language is a "paper" skill. But I don't care what anyone says, knowing the language as well as possible CAN benefit you downrange. If for no other reason than as a veracity check on your interpreter. I could see putting language second or giving it a lower priority if it is competing with range time, or other combat oriented training. But these guys ARE IN LANGUAGE SCHOOL. The Army is paying them to sit here and listen, and if they apply themselves it's possible they could learn something that will help them downrange. IMHO, as long as you're stuck in a school where the skill they're teaching is relevant, then you should try to pick up as much of it as you can.

The other reality is that since the 1/1/1 standard has been in place they're still graduating over 95% of the students (which, they say, is about what it was before), so it's clear that 1/1/1 is an achievable standard.
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Post by Smiddy »

Alright for fucksake!

I'm not saying language skills should not be improved. I'm saying it's not number one friggin priority. I was responding to the slighted comment on the lack of language knowledge.

Leatherneck, that is a mature and well thought out comment, and I agree with you. The reality is different. I try to take time and keep up my Russian, but Arabic is the language of the land. The priority is for a basic conversation to win rapport. It is irrealistic to think you'll have the skill to conduct interrogations and teach intensive tactics with SOLT knowledge.

Psywar, no disrespect intended, but what the fuck are you talking about? FID, DA, SR, SO are core SF missions that are conducted at the same time or from mission to mission. You don't pick someone on what mission you'll do the next deployment. If it's FID I'm supposed to want the guy with better language over the guy with better MOS skills? Never! Better MOS skills make him a better teacher; not better language skills. We'll be using Titan just like everyone else.

I speak with ground truth. And once more current ground truth. That being said, I'm for better language skills, but don't slight a guy because his language skills suck after the improved course. Hold him to the standard, but a 1, 1 is still not doing shit without an interpreter.

Leatherneck, I look forward to seeing you on the force, brother. Your first impression will be made by PT and MOS skill. Good Luck!

Psywar, if I came down hard it's because I'm assuming you are not 18 series and I found your rationale odd and offbase.

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