Dealing with death

SmokeEater10500 · Post by **SmokeEater10500** » March 31st, 2005, 2:25 pm

I know this is a sensitive subject, but with what happened today, a lot of questions have been asked. This morning at PT, we were out on a ruck march and came across a body. From what we could tell she had been raped (totally naked) and had been strangled (ligature marks around her neck.) This shook a lot of our guys up. A lot of people started wondering whether or not dealing with these kinds of situations becomes easier in a sense. Do you become more desensitized to it the more you see it, or does it always strike home? I know that finding someone who has been raped and murdered is different than seeing someone who died in combat, but I think the concept is still basically the same. I know this subject is a sensitive one, but if anyone is willing to shed any light on this, it'd be a huge help. Thanks
-SmokeEater

rgrpuck · Post by **rgrpuck** » March 31st, 2005, 2:35 pm

You just deal with it.

Silverback · Post by **Silverback** » March 31st, 2005, 2:39 pm

rgrpuck wrote:You just deal with it.

I'll break it down....

If it's your day...it's your day! It doesn't matter if your knitting a sweater or surrounded by bad guys. Whatever the case...it's your day!

BattleBoar · Post by **BattleBoar** » March 31st, 2005, 2:48 pm

rgrpuck wrote:You just deal with it.

Concur.

First one you see might set you back a step. Then you remind yourself, "I've got shit to do," and you continue to scan.

(Now a young lady on the side of the road is a completely different story, but I don't think that's what we're talking about.)

medicchick · Post by **medicchick** » March 31st, 2005, 2:49 pm

Pardon me for stepping in gentlemen, but working as a paramedic, I saw my share of dead bodies. You learn to not dwell on it, and to go about your day. I'd work on one, and then go eat. It became no big deal, BUT, I didn't know them.

KW Driver · Post by **KW Driver** » March 31st, 2005, 4:35 pm

I agree with what was said above. That being said, when time and security allows, work it out. If you need to talk about it, or what bothers you about it, talk it out. get it all out. You need to foster an atmosephere where it's acceptable to admit being hurt by it. I buried my PL Ranger buddy who died for no fucking reason we've ever found out after an out-patient sinus surgery. I gave his wife the Flag that covered him. we were all stunned when we found out the news, my other buddy in the unit who was a RI was in school and found out two days later when he came back. we sat and talked about it and cried about it. I cried off and on for the week it took to burry him. I cried like a bitch during the memorial service. No one ever called me a pussy for it and that's the way it should be. If we can share everything we do, we can share tears and heartache too.

rgrpuck · Post by **rgrpuck** » March 31st, 2005, 10:03 pm

Like I said, you deal with it.

If it is the enemy, you did your job. Keep doing it.

A civilian, it is war. Hopefully it wont happen again.

Someone you know, you grieve. The hardest time is listening to the roll call, followed by taps. The worst ever was in Bld 4 after Somalia. I saw General Downing weeping there.

Then you put your armor back on, pick up your weapon, put everything but your job out of your mind, and go back to work.

Bottom line ...... you just fucking deal with it.

Kyla · Post by **Kyla** » March 31st, 2005, 11:36 pm

I completely understand how seeing and dealing with bodies on a regular basis can, and some would say should, harden you towards death. I think one should however take a moment when the time is appropriate to remember that the body you just saw did belong to someone who was loved and respected by someone, somewhere. While it may not be a big deal to you, it is a big deal to someone.

I will forever be grateful that when my husband was killed that he was surrounded by the men he served with. Men who knew him, cared for him, and respected him. If I couldn't be there as he passed, knowing there were others that did care with him made all the difference in the world. I would hate to think that my husband was simply another body to work on, another fallen soldier that one could try and save and then forget about.

While I can only attempt to understand the challenges of the jobs that put you in such situations, I would like to think that I would take a moment when time allowed to say a quick prayer on behalf of the fallen and those that loved them, whether I knew them or not.

That said, I agree with most of what everyone else has already noted. You have to deal with it, move on, grieve when/if appropriate, and get back to your job/life.

mikelogics · Post by **mikelogics** » April 1st, 2005, 1:29 am

Same here

I was ambushed and pinned down twice during my Mindanao tour. I survived only to appreciate how lucky I am to be alive. I've also lost many friends. Most of them better men than me.

On "other" occasions, I've done stuff my own family would consider immoral.

Well, that's war for you. Its always best to store those memories away as best you could, or it will drive you nuts. Whatever happens in the field, STAYS in the field.

ma91c1an · Post by **ma91c1an** » April 1st, 2005, 3:54 am

sorry that happened, brother.

it is entirely legit to feel fucked up about something like this.

as a leader, it is important for you to set the tone for the troopers under your charge, and make sure that they understand that it is ok to be upset. One of the worst things that I have ever seen is young Rangers confused about killing, death, and remorse. Older guys just seem to have a better handle, and let it out. Which is the right thing to do (after you are back in the rear, and not in the middle of doing your job).

for some reason, younger Rangers...just did not seem to know how to feel. It was almost like they were looking for guidance on how to react.

the right way to feel, and the right way to react, is to allow yourself to feel sorrow and regret, and remorse.

then you get your shit back together, and you go back out and you do your job.

it is also entirely natural to feel fucked up for a period of time...say two or three weeks. You work through that time, you push through that shit, and you get past it. With time, it fades, and you naturally process the experience.

what you should not permit, under any circumstances, is young Rangers cracking jokes about the dead, making hand puppets with body parts, or any other grotesque behavior. You set the example, and you show appropriate respect and solemnity for the dead. If your nugs misbehave, you crush their fucking nuts.

there is a time and place for mockery and joking around, and dealing with the dead is not it.

Steadfast · Post by **Steadfast** » April 1st, 2005, 7:19 pm

Uncle Steadfast shall show you all how some behave towards those dying of wounds and one's conviction of religion. The following is a Medal of Honor winner posthumusly that gave his all for those young Marines lying on the battlefield in South Vietnam years ago. This is one of our hometown boys.

*CAPODANNO, VINCENT R.

Rank and organization: Lieutenant, U.S. Navy, Chaplain Corps, 3d Battalion, 5th Marines, 1st Marine Division (Rein), FMF. Place and date: Quang Tin Province, Republic of Vietnam, 4 September 1967. Entered service at: Staten Island, N.Y. Born: 13 February 1929, Staten Island, N.Y. Citation: For conspicuous gallantry and intrepidity at the risk of his life above and beyond the call of duty as Chaplain of the 3d Battalion, in connection with operations against enemy forces. In response to reports that the 2d Platoon of M Company was in danger of being overrun by a massed enemy assaulting force, Lt. Capodanno left the relative safety of the company command post and ran through an open area raked with fire, directly to the beleaguered platoon. Disregarding the intense enemy small-arms, automatic-weapons, and mortar fire, he moved about the battlefield administering last rites to the dying and giving medical aid to the wounded. When an exploding mortar round inflicted painful multiple wounds to his arms and legs, and severed a portion of his right hand, he steadfastly refused all medical aid. Instead, he directed the corpsmen to help their wounded comrades and, with calm vigor, continued to move about the battlefield as he provided encouragement by voice and example to the valiant marines. Upon encountering a wounded corpsman in the direct line of fire of an enemy machine gunner positioned approximately 15 yards away, Lt. Capodanno rushed a daring attempt to aid and assist the mortally wounded corpsman. At that instant, only inches from his goal, he was struck down by a burst of machine gun fire. By his heroic conduct on the battlefield, and his inspiring example, Lt. Capodanno upheld the finest traditions of the U.S. Naval Service. He gallantly gave his life in the cause of freedom.

http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/mohviet.htm

.

fireranger · Post by **fireranger** » April 1st, 2005, 10:33 pm

medicchick wrote:Pardon me for stepping in gentlemen, but working as a paramedic, I saw my share of dead bodies. You learn to not dwell on it, and to go about your day. I'd work on one, and then go eat. It became no big deal, BUT, I didn't know them.

I concur with medicchick......in EMS you see some pretty weird stuff, but it is amazing how quickly you become insensitive to it. You just try and remember that they were someone's loved one, offer condolences to the family, do your job and be a professional about it.